"Nobi" (nobi)
05/01/2016 at 19:20 • Filed to: None
7
19|
"Nobi" (nobi)
05/01/2016 at 19:20 • Filed to: None | 7
| 19 |
About 6000 miles ago at 297,xxx miles, I changed the timing belt, water pump, and drive belts on my winter beater Civic.
This guy. I tracked down the last dealership that it was serviced at, and they told me that they hadn’t seen it since 240,xxx miles, and had no record of the timing belt being changed. I figured for peace of mind, I’d better get on that. A little while after the service, I noticed there was a whine in the engine somewhere that would go away after it warmed up. I paid no mind to it as I figured if it was something dire, it wouldn’t go away when warm. Fast forward to about a month ago. I left the house to go to a dentist appointment. I got 2 miles down the road and the engine just shut off. No strange sounds, no weird noises, just silence. After coasting to the side of the road and opening the hood, all I could smell was burnt rubber from the timing belt area. After getting a tow to work and tearing the covers off, I found this:
All caused by this jerk:
The one thing I didn’t replace. Stupid tensioner decided it didn’t want all of its bearings anymore and seized up solid. That explains the whine that happened when cold. Now for any of you that know Honda engines, you’ll know they’re an interference type. The valves and pistons occupy the same place, but are kept from meeting by being in time. Remove the timing belt and well, bang, snap, smash happens. Since my poor old rust bucket isn’t worth the tires it’s rolling on and my bills and mortgage are more important, swapping a new engine in wasn’t an option. I was afraid I’d killed my wagon from ignorance, not knowing the tensioner had to be replaced during the service. Hoping for a last ditch at throwing a new belt on and hoping it ran halfway decently, I found a new timing belt kit, with a new tensioner, on rock auto for $40. I figured that was worth a try, and much better than scrapping the car. After installing those, I crossed my fingers, and well: (apologies for vertical ipotato video)
!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!
!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!
Ignore my brake fluid bottle overflow tank.
I guess the moral of my story is: sometimes it’s not as dire as it seems, don’t give up on your car just because you fear the worst.
Also, change your tensioner pulley.
mazda616
> Nobi
05/01/2016 at 19:35 |
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Yay! I'm glad it lived!
interstate366, now In The Industry
> Nobi
05/01/2016 at 19:39 |
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Seen many an H22 fail due to not changing the tensioner. The OEM auto-adjusting tensioner has a poor reputation, so much so that people will swap to manual tensioner, either from the H23 from the 4th gen Prelude, or an aftermarket one. I’ve stuck with the auto tensioner and have never had an issue, just changing it every time.
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Nobi
> interstate366, now In The Industry
05/01/2016 at 19:46 |
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I had no idea. Prior to this, the oldest Honda I’ve ever done a timing belt on was a 2000 Civic, but it got all new parts anyway due to overheating and a warped cylinder head. IF my Civic makes it to its next belt change, I’ll be sure to remember it.
dogisbadob
> Nobi
05/01/2016 at 19:47 |
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Timing chains are awesome :)
BJ
> Nobi
05/01/2016 at 19:50 |
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You were lucky! What’s the recommended interval? On my Toyota V8 it’s 90 000 miles. I’d hate to find out what happens when the belt fails on a big motor...
MM54
> BJ
05/01/2016 at 19:57 |
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About the same, but more valves meet more pistons
DasWauto
> Nobi
05/01/2016 at 20:02 |
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That joy when you’re prepared for and half-expecting the worst and the worst doesn’t happen, love it.
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Nobi
> dogisbadob
05/01/2016 at 20:12 |
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Not all of them. I’ve lost count of how many stretched chains on K24s I’ve seen replaced. That's more due to the owner going too long between oil change intervals, but still.
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Nobi
> BJ
05/01/2016 at 20:13 |
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I think on the D series it's about every 90k. HondAcura later changed it to 105k.
RazoE
> dogisbadob
05/01/2016 at 20:33 |
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My mazdaspeed3 would like a word with you. MZRs don’t always fail, but when they do, BOOM. Just did mine 2 months ago, so that’s good.
E92M3
> Nobi
05/01/2016 at 20:39 |
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The timing chain is separate from the parts that are oiled. It’s on the outside of the engine. Oil change intervals don’t affect it, unless something inside the engine is destroyed.
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E92M3
> Nobi
05/01/2016 at 20:42 |
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ALWAYS change the tensioner and idler pulley/pullies. $50 or less is well worth it for the piece of mind. They fail more often than honda water pumps. If you’re going to skimp, don’t change the water pump.
HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
> Nobi
05/01/2016 at 21:37 |
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Something funny, on the 4G63 the Timing belt interval is about ever 50,000 miles. only because the hydraulic tensioner won’t last much longer than that. In fact the tensioner was reason I had to do a t belt change in my Galant.
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Nobi
> E92M3
05/01/2016 at 22:06 |
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Not on a K series. It’s an ongoing issue with them. They also burn oil, so lack of oil+higher engine temperatures from lack of lubrication and extended service intervals=stretched chain. I’ve personally seen K24s that still run decently, but have chains stretched so badly, the auto tensioner can’t physically extend any further out.
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Nobi
> E92M3
05/01/2016 at 22:08 |
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Lesson learned. Still going to change the water pump since I’m in there.
duurtlang
> HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
05/02/2016 at 05:10 |
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Tell me more about the 4g63. I’m having the belts changed on one very soon, I’m not going to do it myself but I’ve ordered the parts myself. They’re in the mail as we speak. It’s a SOHC 4g63 in a ‘97 Galant wagon (Euro market), if that matters. I’ve noticed two timing belts
and
two of those auxiliary belts (don’t know the correct English word). Anyway, the belts were last changed in 1-2010 and a little over 50k
km
ago. It whines when cold, and the whine is increasing.
I’ve ordered two tensioner pulleys, one for each timing belt, and a guide pulley for belt A. No water pump.
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E92M3
> Nobi
05/02/2016 at 09:50 |
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The real culprit is a bad oil pressure operated tensioner design. It causes the guides to not operate properly, therfore not giving ideal tension at lower RPM. Which causes stretching. Even if you change the oil every 3k miles it can fail. If you run 2 quarts low, you could cause low oil pressure, and poor operation leading to a quicker failure.
http://www.superstreetonline.com/how-to/engine/…
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HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
> duurtlang
05/02/2016 at 16:41 |
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IDK much about the sohc 4g63, or if the bottom end is different. But mine had two timing belts, one is the cam belt, the other is for a balance shaft. Both need to be changed. Why not just buy a total T belt kit? I Bought all the parts, and the water pump in one package.
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duurtlang
> HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
05/02/2016 at 16:53 |
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Same here, one for the balance shaft, the other one for the cam belt. I bought two kits, one for each belt. No full kit available, they’re not the most common engines here. I paid slightly over €100 for the two kits combined, excluding water pump. It required some research or it would’ve cost double. Japanese car parts are relatively expensive here, I’m used to cheaper parts (by the same/similar manufacturers) for French and German cars.